OCTOBER 29, 2014
(from the Introduction, page 18)
Howard: When Robin Williams—I don’t know if you were a fan of his.
Mike: I knew Robin.
Howard: You knew him personally?
Mike: Yeah.
Howard: How’d you meet him?
Mike: Trust me, people that deal with this situation, we know each other. We all know each other.
Howard: Were you at meetings with him?
Mike: I’ve been at a meeting with him, yeah.
Howard: And so when you were in a meeting with him, you knew he suffered from depression. Did you guys confide in one another?
Mike: Listen, this is very interesting. When I met him, he said, “I was waiting for you.” And he started telling me about somebody I was purchasing from. And in my mind I’m saying—’cause you look up to Robin. He’s high status. I say to myself, “How does he know this low-life dealer that I go to? They shouldn’t even be in the same state together.” You go to any measure to get high or to use when you’re in that situation. So everybody knows everybody.
Howard: You’re saying the world of drugs makes you go to the lowest common denominator.
Mike: Oh yes.
Howard: So when you wake up and you read that Robin Williams has killed himself, does it throw you into a tailspin? Does it make you think, “Oh shit, maybe I’m capable of this”?
Mike: One hundred percent. But more so when Mr. [Philip Seymour] Hoffman passed away. Because this is what you say—this is what my thick head says: “Wow, he was sober for twenty-something years and he died. What kind of chance do I stand?” You know what I mean? You think that he’s clear and free. But we’re never clear and free.
Howard: Do you ever have suicidal thoughts? Especially when a Robin Williams dies? Does that trigger it?
Mike: Listen, if you have a mental illness you’re gonna think about suicide. Suicide is our comfort. He really killed the wrong person, you know what I mean? It was all about killing that disease that he possessed. It’s not about killing yourself.
Howard: He was killing what? The voice in his head? Is that what it is? Is it a voice in your head or something? I don’t understand.
Mike: Think of it like this. You’re starving. You’re absolutely famished. And that drug—heroin, cocaine—that’s food.
Howard: You’ll do anything to get it. So how the hell did you get off it?
Mike: Well, listen, I don’t know if I’m off it. I’m clean now. This is a constant fight. And eventually that dark entity is gonna knock on the door. It’s gonna come back. And we’re gonna find out if all this training I’ve been doing is working. Am I gonna get knocked out and use? Or am I gonna raise my hand and go in the other direction? That’s what it comes down to.
Howard: It seems insurmountable to me that you were able to kick it.
Mike: Well, for most people it is. But you have to be in the fight to even think about winning. You have to be in the fight. With everything you have.