Twenty-Three

Maxine Sanders

The very first of the thirteen respected elders I had the privilege of interviewing was Maxine Sanders, who describes her spiritual tradition in terms of being a “Witch and Priestess of the Goddess.” I can’t begin to express how excited and honoured I felt when Maxine agreed to this, for she is without doubt one of the world’s most well-known and well-respected witches. Her late husband Alex was the founder of one of the two largest Wiccan traditions, known as Alexandrian Witchcraft. Maxine’s latest autobiography, Firechild, is a truly fascinating adventure for the reader, as she lifts the curtains in a world rarely glimpsed by the uninitiated. As with all the other sections, at the end of each interview is a brief biography.

MT: Maxine, first of all I must thank you for taking the time to speak with me. I do appreciate it.

MS: You’re very welcome, Mark.

MT: Perhaps I might begin by talking a little about your incredible autobiography, Firechild, and some of the amazing experiences you describe in relation to Christianity and certain “followers of Jesus.” For example, you experienced both extreme fear, even hatred from some Christians, and yet also kindness, acceptance, and affection from others.

MS: Indeed, an example of the former would be an occasion when I came home to my mother’s house and was met by the local Catholic priest and two of his large and very adult altar “boys,” who proceeded to attempt an aggressive exorcism of sorts, deafening me with prayers, drenching me in holy water, and forcing me to the ground.

MT: My gosh! As a teenage young woman, that must have been terrifying. And yet there are other stories of a much more accepting relationship between you, Alex, and the Catholic Church. For example, is it right to say that at one point in time, the robes for your coven were made by the nuns of a local convent in return for Alex’s mediumship skills and the séances he’d perform for them?

MS: Yes, that’s true.

MT: Amazing. Anyway, we must get onto the main subject of this book, which is not so much the Church or Christianity but Jesus himself, who of course was not a Christian but a Jew. So let me ask you, was the figure of Jesus, to a lesser or greater degree, part of your upbringing as a child?

MS: Christianity was the religion of my childhood; Church of England until the age of seven, when my mother converted to Roman Catholicism. I was devout in my faith and loved the ceremonies, particularly Benediction.

MT: But did he [Jesus] feel important to you at all?

MS: No, not really, and especially not now. I have found an enjoyable sense of peace based in the realms of nature and the seasonal rituals of Witchcraft.

MT: If you were to imagine Jesus, how is or isn’t his spirit reflected in the modern-day Church? Do any Pagan traditions or concepts reflect the spirit of Jesus better?

MS: Christianity is obviously still a religion that gives a sense of belonging and peace to many. The spirit of Jesus is needed and, whilst that need is met by Christianity, it clearly has worth. Paganism is not fulfilling for everyone.

MT: What feelings or thoughts does the Christmas story conjure up in you?

MS: Memories of Christmas Eve midnight mass, drunks reeling up the aisle, incense, mince pies, sherry, and feelings of joy that the Christ brought light into the world.

MT: And Easter?

MS: Sensations of hunger brought about through the fasting until after 3 p.m. on Good Friday and thoughts of the crucified Christ reeking of emotional blackmail to be good.

MT: If you have one, what is your favourite story, parable, teaching, or symbol of Jesus?

MS: Stone throwing comes to mind; I think it was one of the best and least listened to.

MT: Who do you think Jesus was? For example [was he] a simple Jewish teacher, a divine prophet, a valid deity of the Christian pantheon, a miracle worker, a magician, etc.?

MS: I see him as a teacher, prophet, miracle worker, and valid deity of the Christian pantheon. Who am I to deny the Christ’s validity? Although, having known many magicians, Jesus strikes me as far more secure in his being than those magicians.

MT: Wonderful. And what lesson do you feel the modern-day church needs to hear from the person/teaching of Jesus?

MS: Having suffered the stone throwing and deafness, the church’s hypocrisy is loud. They are experts at teaching/pontificating, sadly lacking in priestly listening.

MT: This is a controversial question, not only for Christians but also within the Pagan world. Do you consider it possible to be both Christian and Pagan?

MS: As a practising witch I found no conflict when for a while, ritual within the circle of Witchcraft was my religious practise on most days of the week. On Sunday morning, the mass in the Liberal Catholic Church was most enjoyable and uplifting.

MT: So what, if anything, can modern-day Pagans learn from the message/person of Jesus?

MS: Modern-day Pagans could learn a tremendous amount from the message of Jesus, although rather less from the interpretation of modern-day Christian clergy.

MT: And what, if anything, can Christians learn from modern-day
Paganism?

MS: Unless they want to, nothing.

MT: Maxine, it’s been a real pleasure to speak to you about these things. Once again, I do thank for your time.

MS: You’re welcome, Mark.

About the Author

Maxine Sanders was initiated into Wicca in 1964. The High Priest was Alex Sanders, known throughout the world as the “King of the Witches.” He and Maxine were Handfasted in 1965 and married in 1968. They became household names during the sixties and seventies, bringing modern Witchcraft into global consciousness. Today Maxine is a highly respected Priestess of the Sacred Mysteries and has encouraged, enabled, and inspired many students and Initiates. Several of Maxine’s pupils have become accomplished teachers of esoteric knowledge and work internationally. Maxine’s vocation as a priestess includes talking to audiences who wish to listen and counseling those who are in need of kindness, truth, and hope.

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