Alfredo

Ibiza’s magician

Interviewed by Bill in London on May 31, 2007

Alfredo is an Argentinian exile, driven from his home by the junta, who found peace, love and acid house in Ibiza. Arguably the most influential modern DJ in Europe, it was his eclectic style, with a distinct Latin twist, that provided the catalyst for the wild upheaval of the rave years. His playlist was pored over and rifled through by visiting British DJs, as they filched his template and fired up the clubs of London on premium-grade ecstasy and mad indie records by the Woodentops. Without Alfredo there may never have been an acid house explosion in Great Britain.

Often by necessity, but certainly by design as well, Alfredo combined the most unlikely records into an elegant cascade. The supply of music was limited and there were long hours to fill, so restrictions were pointless. What struck the Brits who heard him, used to the snobberies of rare groove, was the innocent enthusiasm for beautiful music. Forget any preconceptions about an artist, ignore any boundaries of style, if it sounds great with the sun caressing your limbs and the waves sparkling in the distance, then give it a try. Assisted by Ibiza’s reputation for hedonism, its beautiful open-air clubs and its glamorous Eurotrash jet-set, the Balearic formula was a winning one.

The sun is shining over the Emirates Stadium, the Arsenal football ground that towers over the surrounding area, including Rob Mello’s attic studio. Rob is engineering Alfredo’s Ministry Of Sound compilation and we’ve come to chat about his life and how he changed music. He has the look of someone who has lived a full life and paid the consequences (Alfredo is avowedly anti-drugs these days), but is still full of good humour and a quiet energy.

Why did you move to Ibiza in the first place?

I never meant to go to Ibiza. I left Argentina because the social conditions there were dangerous and horrible for everybody between 20 and 30. I left for Europe in a boat. It took me 22 days. Four-hundred psychotherapists were on the boat. The government were closing universities and psychotherapists were out of work and were persecuted. I was persecuted as a promoter of rock’n’roll groups.

We arrived in October 1976. It was very cold. We went to Paris, then we went to Switzerland. The money ended and I got a letter from a friend from Argentina who was living in Ibiza saying, ‘Come and live here, it’s fantastic!’ I arrived in a boat from Barcelona and within five minutes of setting foot on the island I said, ‘Wow, this is the place I want to live!’ There was just so much freedom. The climate was like my town in Argentina. We have a hot summer and even the plants reminded me of Argentina. I’d met with other Argentinian friends who were there and I saw I had the chance to live as I wanted to live… as a hippie [chuckles].

Why was it such an attractive place?

The space, the nature, the beaches. On one side you have the climate, the beaches and the nature and then on the other side you’ve got a population who, when I arrived, the Ibicenco was a very permissive person with a lot of solidarity for young people, something that now is flaking. At the time, I think we respected the Ibicenco much more than they do now, because now they see the young as invaders, I think. I’m thankful to them they gave me the opportunity to re-make my life and my relationship with music came from Ibiza.

What did you do when you first arrived?

Candles. I made them and sold them on a market.

How did you move towards DJing?

That was 1982. Because a friend of mine left his bar to live in Thailand. And in the bar there were turntables, so I start to work as barman and DJ. I’d been running the bar in winter of 1982-83 and he left me the records too.

What sort of music did you play? Was it just the stuff he left you?

Chic Corea, jazz fusion.

How did you progress into clubs from there?

After that I took the decision that I would become a DJ in Amnesia.

Why Amnesia in particular?

It was the most alternative place in Ibiza.

Tell me about your Amnesia audition.

I went Amnesia in 1983 to check with the owner to see if he wants me to play. It was an impossible time because the discotheque never worked. But they decided to take someone else, and I did very well, but they didn’t want me to play, so I went to live in Formentera managing a bar. In 1984, the same people decided to take me as resident DJ at Amnesia.

Were there other DJs there?

Just me the whole night. My first year was really difficult. By the end of August 1984, we had not had one person in the club.

“  There was no private area at all. The prices were affordable. The public was the most cosmopolitan ever. ”

Not one?!

Well maybe some friends of mine. Never more than three people. Then one day we’d been waiting to get paid and some of the people in the club, my work colleagues, asked me to play for them while we waited for the money. The people that came down from Ku [now Privilege], they listen to the music and stay there. Fifty to 60 people. The next day there was 300, the day after 500 and four days later there was 1,000 in the club. Just like that.

Did you stop opening early?

Yeah, we decided to open at 3 o’clock and close at 12.

What sort of music would you have been playing in the summer of 1984?

Pink Floyd, Marvin Gaye, Bob Marley and Italian and Spanish records like Lucio Battisti and Nina, a very famous diva. In the ’80s there was a very big movement in Madrid called La Movida. From that movement came Pedro Almodovar, the director. There were many groups who played a sort of rock fusion and one of them was Radio Futura. Alaska [Mexican-Spanish singer] was very good friends of Pedro and the singer of Radio Futura, which I played.

Was this dance music?

Most of the tracks were music to dance to, apart from ‘Moments In Love’ by Art of Noise, but they used to dance even to ‘Moments Of Love’ or Malcolm McLaren’s ‘Madam Butterfly’.

What sort of people came to Amnesia that summer?

Basically people leaving Ku to start with, but by September everybody living on the island. Many Italians, Germans and French. Not many English. San Antonio was packed with English but not anywhere else.

What was the clientele like?

They were old, young, middle-aged, black, white. The biggest mix I’ve ever played for.

Were there any drugs around in 1984?

Yeah, but… how can I say this… it wasn’t like now where people go to a club and they have to have this or that. It was more free. It was like, ‘Okay, if I find something I take it, but if not I enjoy the music and have a drink’. And it wasn’t like it is now where you can go to discotheques for 24 hours. The moment we close at 12 o’clock or one in the afternoon, there was nothing else. It was a lot more healthy.

Describe Amnesia to me

Amnesia was like dancing on the patio and garden of an Ibicenco house with a sound system that nowadays would be thought of as shit. Imagine we got a triangle, one bass bin, two middles and one high. There were no lights, no strobe, apart from these three lights that you might get in a funfair, a transparent parachute over the dancefloor, plants all over and completely open air. There was no private area at all. The prices were affordable. The public was the most cosmopolitan ever. Even now, it’s hard to find a crowd like that. That’s the thing that I miss in the discotheques now. I think there’s a big division between the young and old that didn’t exist before. An atmosphere of absolute freedom and happiness. This is not hype, it was like that. The drugs weren’t the main thing; the people used to go to listen to the music. People went for the dancing, not for the gallery; really dancing.

How did Amnesia progress from that first season?

In 1985 and 1986 it was getting bigger and we became the trendy place in Ibiza. But in 1986 or ’87 Space opened. And Space started to send us the police.

There has always been a lot of that going on hasn’t there?

Yeah. The owner of Space was the Minister for Foreign Office. And he’s the owner of most things here, including the banks. He opened a convention centre for business, then he decided to convert it into a discotheque, which become an after-hours discotheque that opened at six in morning. Obviously we were the rivals. And they tried to send the police. They made us close in 1986 at 10, then at seven. But from ’88, there was a big change when these people came from UK, like Paul Oakenfold and Danny Rampling and Nancy Noise.

When did you meet the English guys like Trevor Fung?

I met them in Amnesia, but I never speak English at the time. So our relationship was, ‘Hello, how are you?’ My biggest relationship was with the girls Lisa Loud and Nancy, because they were more cheeky. Trevor and Paul [Oakenfold] were DJs and you know how DJs are: you’re not gonna show that you wanna know which records are playing. So they used to send Nancy [laughs]. I never knew it at the time!

Where were you getting your records from? Was there a record store on the island?

Yes there was a record store on the island, but most of my records came from Germany, because my son was living there, and I used to go to warehouses and distributors in Italy, like Disco Inn and Disco Piu and also in Zurich, but I don’t remember the name of the shop.

Where was the first time you heard house music?

The first time I heard house music was in Madrid in 1985. There was a black guy from America who used to bring records over for DJs. There wasn’t much importation of records. He used to come with a bag from New York and one time he showed me The It ‘Donnie’ on DJ International. I went mad for this record. This is fantastic music! The black guy was an American, around 40 at the time, he used to be a basketball player but he got married to a Spanish woman in Madrid and he brought records over. He used to rent a room in a hotel, the DJs would go there to listen to the music and buy the records from him.

Did he supply DJs all over Spain?

No only Madrid. He got business from a military base, there was a massive one near Madrid; he brought music for them, too.

Where did you find records like ‘Jesus On The Payroll’ [by Thrashing Doves] and Woodentops? [‘Well, Well, Well’]?

I bought ‘Jesus On The Payroll’ in Italy. The Woodentops, Fini Tribe, Residents and Nitzer Ebb I got from Valencia, because at the time in Valencia, it used to have a very strong movement of music Bacalao [Spanish for cod]. They called it Bacalao, because the amphetamine they used to take smelled of fish! Horrible.

Nitzer Ebb, Fini Tribe were quite industrial records, really. What was the attraction?

I’d been really attracted to house music, but we never really had that many. Then in Valencia in the same period of time, there was a very strong club scene based much more on techno music and I used to buy records in Valencia too. I had quite a big following from Valencia [in Amnesia].

What was the reaction to these records the first time you played them?

In Amnesia it was fantastic right from the first time.

Was Jean-Claude Maury [influential French DJ] anything to do with any of this?

No, he was the DJ of Glory’s. To tell you the truth he was the person that influenced me more than anybody. What I did, you could say was a Latin version of what he was doing. He was a French guy working in Brussels at the Mirano, but in Ibiza he had to do what I did: mixing music to bring people together. He had nothing to do with Bacalao, he was much more funky and played more American music. He played things like Johnny Chingas’ ‘Phone Home’. He was also into Eurythmics, Tears for Fears, David Bowie, and he played a lot of reggae. The people who went to Glory’s never went to Pacha.

Did you start incorporating house into your sets straight away?

Yeah.

And did that go over really well?

Yeah. Even with my terrible mixing! There was a record that became massive in Amnesia called ‘House Nation’, because the people when they heard ‘house, ho-ho-house nation’ they understood Amnesia. It became massive!

When did you first notice ecstasy in Amnesia?

To tell you the truth the first thing I noticed was people taking mescaline. ’85. Ecstasy was for the rich people that used to the private parties. Most of the people used to say, ‘Yeah, it’s a drug to shag with. You give it to a woman and she opens her legs.’ [laughter] Most of them used acid, but you know hippies and post-hippie people, they used to take the drugs more seriously. They wanted an experience that was going to open their mind and ecstasy wasn’t that type of thing: it was a pleasure drug.

But it was a factor in Amnesia wasn’t it?

No.

Even in 1987?

Yes, in 1987 it was cocaine and ecstasy.

But it wasn’t big before 1987, then?

No, ecstasy was big in Ku. In Amnesia they used to take mescaline and acid. They didn’t mix things. And once in a while, not every fuckin’ day. I had to pay a price because I got into it in a quite big way. I paid a big price for it. I would love you to say this in the interview.

When did you leave Amnesia?

1989.

At the end of the season?

No, I went to work in London and they sacked me. They took my DJ that used to work with me, a guy from Italy who I knew – he wasn’t a DJ, but he was a very good guy. But in the end it was alright because Amnesia went down. The last season that was open air was 1989. By 1990 they’d covered it [added a roof]. They year after they offered me the job to run the discotheque. But I was in Pacha and they’d been paying me a lot. They said, ‘We pay what you want, but you have to bring the English people in here’! Now it’s full of English people.

What’s your greatest memory of playing in Amnesia?

There are so many I cannot tell you one. The people that were working there, the colleagues, the bartenders and everything. We went through a very hard first season. And the owners never got money so we have to do the sound ourselves, we had to pool money together. In 1984 we played with no fucking mixer, just two turntables. It was impossible to play. I used to cut the records: one, two, three, four, cut the record. It was another kind of mixing. It was more the feeling of the music than the beat.

“  When the first people came here, like Pink Floyd and the guys avoiding Vietnam, they found people living in an isolated life. ”

That’s something that’s been lost in Ibiza now, hasn’t it?

It’s been lost all over the world. I don’t know. Now we live in a mechanical and electronic world and the pressure is greater than it was 30 years ago. The pressure for money, to live, it’s much more great and the music is reflecting the life we live.

How do you feel when you see the huge influence you’ve had in Europe and the UK?

Different feelings… In a way, I was in the right place, at the right time doing the right thing. It was mostly what the Americans had been doing in America with the house music. But obviously what I was playing was much more European than them, because I was playing the Cure, Pink Floyd and New Order. I used to put acappellas over the first house tracks just to do something different with them. I mixed everything up, black and white, European and American. We know about English history, French history, Italian history, so I mixed it all up!

Why is Ibiza such a party island?

Because Ibicencos… it’s not that they are very open-minded, because they are not. But it’s a people that live and let live. When the first people came here, like the people from Pink Floyd and the Americans, the guys avoiding going to Vietnam, they found people living an isolated life. They didn’t have a connection with the continent: one boat a week or something like that. Tourism wasn’t big. And they accept these people. Apparently the first people was good people. Apart from the drugs, they don’t steal things, they respect the people. The Ibicencos has been invaded by so many people in the ’80s, dance people, clubbers, tourism, they are used to it. Their country has lots of influences from all over. Now they are rejecting it a bit, because – I’m getting into politics – they are conscious that they are destroying the island.

Do you think a lot of people got greedy for all the money they could make?

Of course. Not the first generation. Not the grandfathers. The people that I met was, frankly, fantastic. When I had my son and my ex-wife left the country, when I came back to the same owner of the house and he said, ‘Yeah, it’s your house forever’. There is a law that if someone is born in the house you cannot evict him from that house until he is 18. They’ve been very strong on those things. They never charged much for rent. They’ve never been used to big cars and swimming pools.

The second generation got the problems with drugs; the third generation, this generation, is very greedy. Their ancestors had their own culture and it was enough to live in the island. They knew everything that they had to do to be okay here. But these people now they forgot about their own culture and they don’t have a new one.

How would you describe the spirit of Ibiza?

Confused at the moment! [laughter]. I think it’s the possibility to have some natural fun to contact people who they would never have met in their own place. That happens even now, even with a crisis. If I were a young person I would say, ‘Wow this is fantastic, this is wonderful!’ like I did 30 years ago. The rest of the world changed in the last 20 years. It’s keeping the same difference as everywhere else.

What did you think when these crazy British people started bringing you to London?

It was like a dream come true. It was incredible. When I arrived they showed me a page in the Independent with a note all along the side of the page, all about me, making a new kind of music. Wow, this was incredible. I was never conscious of any of this.

It must have been a thrill though.

Completely surprised. I never thought that people were so much into my music. The first gig I did I had no tunes to play because the DJ before me was playing all my records! He was doing the same mixes, except better because he had been practising. The first ever English gig I got was in Streatham at Project Club which was great until the police came. I played for one hour. Someone parked their car in the middle of the road so a milk float couldn’t pass and the police came in and closed it down.

But you came back to Shoom didn’t you?

Yeah, I got a residency from Danny Rampling. I used to live in London in the winter.

What was it like playing for a crowd in London compared to Ibiza?

Well, I used to play at the Milk Bar and Velvet Underground. And there was a party with Danny Rampling, and most of the people used to go Ibiza, and I was quite popular at the time. I had a following then. So it wasn’t much different.

Why do you think your music had such a big influence on people like Danny Rampling?

I think I showed them DJing wasn’t an impossible thing. It had been dominated by older DJs in the UK. They were the untouchables. So I think I opened their minds so they thought, ‘Okay, I can do this, too’.

Do you think the incredible mix of people you had at Amnesia affected the atmosphere in any way?

It was a like an alternative European Community, this gathering of these people. It showed you what might be possible in the future. They were all European… apart from the English!

What do you think about what ecstasy has done on the island?

I can only tell you what my doctor told me. He said that massive consumption of ecstasy will send you into depression. That’s it. It’s a tricky thing and at the moment… I don’t know, it’s very dangerous.

Did you ever use ecstasy when you were DJing?

Ah, man, you not going to put this in the book! [laughter]

If you don’t want to tell me something then don’t tell me…

It’s true. It’s not good to do that [chuckles]. It’s not good because you think you play the best gig of your life. And the reality’s not the same.

Do you like the music your son plays?

Yes. I think I’m very hard with my son because I teach him and he’s been with me since day one. At 14 he was selling the tapes for me in the discotheque – and getting much more money than I used to get! One day some Arab guy asked him to give 10 tapes to the girls who were with him. So Jaime says, ‘Okay, each tape is 3,000 pesetas but for you I’ll charge 30,000 pesetas!’ He has very complete musical knowledge from the past yet he’s ashamed to use it, because the fashion of techno and minimal, but anyway I don’t wanna disturb the relationship of my son! Technically he’s like a Swiss watch, it’s amazing.

What does Balearic music mean to you?

Balearic for me is a marketing word. That’s it. The other day they interviewed me for a German music magazine. He asked if Balearic music is really just the music you were playing and I nearly agree with that. It was my taste. It was possible to do that because the public bring information for me. They want this in my set, they want their taste represented in your set and I accommodated that. After that, the classification started and I heard Balearic songs that I would never play but it’s really just a marketing tool. It sounds good as a term but maybe ‘Ibiza music’ would be more representative.

Does it make you feel proud that you’ve had this effect?

It’s not good for my ego because it’s big enough and I don’t want it to control my life. I’m happy that it happened.

© DJhistory.com

AMNESIA 50

MANUEL GÖTTSCHING – E2E4

RADIO FUTURA – Semilla Negra

JOHN LENNON – Imagine

SADE – Smooth Operator

ART OF NOISE – Moments In Love

NINA SIMONE – My Baby Just Care For Me

MIKE POST – Theme From Hill Street Blues

JAMES BROWN – How Do You Stop

ANTENA – Camino Del Sol

ICARUS – Stone Fox Chase

ELKIN AND NELSON – Jibaro

TEN CITY – One Kiss Will Make It Better

TULIO DE PISCOPO – Stop Bajon

ENZO AVITABILE – Blackout

GEORGE KRANZ – Din Da Da

LIAISONS DANGEREUSES – Los Niños Del Parque

DEPECHE MODE – Just Can’t Get enough (Live version)

THE WOODENTOPS – Well Well Well

JOE SMOOTH – Promised Land

TALKING HEADS – Slippery People

THRASHING DOVES – Jesus On The Payroll

BOB MARLEY – Could You Be Loved

PRINCE – When Doves Cry

HENRY MANCINI – Theme from the Pink Panther

RICHIE HAVENS – Going Back To My Roots

ORANGE LEMON – The Texican

FINGERS INC FT MARTIN LUTHER KING – Can You Feel It

WILLIAM PITT – City Lights

HERB ALBERT – Rotation

ATAHUALPA 1530 – Andino (Industrial mix)

THE HOUSE MASTER BOYS – Housenation

RICHIE RICH – Salsa House

RUFUS & CHAKA KHAN – Ain’t Nobody

KC FLIGHTT – Planet E

THE NIGHTWRITERS – Let The Music Take Control:

BARRY WHITE – It’s Ecstasy When You Lay Down Next To Me

GILBERTO GIL – Toda Menina Baiana

IT’S IMMATERIAL – Driving Away From Home

RICKSTER – Night Moves

THE UNKNOWN CASES – Masimba Bele

MALCOM MCLAREN – Madame Butterfly

THE CLASH – The Magnificent Seven

PIL – This Is Not A Love Song

EARTH PEOPLE – Dance

PHUTURE – Acid Tracks

ADAMSKI – N.R.G.

A SPLIT SECOND – Flesh

STEVIE WONDER – Masterblaster

KISSING THE PINK – Big Man Restless

A GUY CALLED GERALD – Voodoo Ray

Compiled by Alfredo