Sissy Thomas Interview
PRODUCER: Hi, Sissy. It’s nice to see you again after the success of the event.
ST: Thank you, it means a lot to me to attend every year.
PRODUCER: So, how did you become involved with Zanna’s story and the event?
ST: Well, when Zanna was killed I’d very recently had my own brush with this hideous crime in a pretty high-profile case. I’m sure you’ve heard about it.
PRODUCER: Yes, I have.
ST: Most have. So, when Zanna’s case hit the media, I was asked by a number of news outlets and TV programmes to give my insight. Then I was asked to appear with Paige on This Morning for her first TV interview, to give another perspective on stalking, and to support Paige. She was very nervous. Bless her. She is such a sweet girl.
PRODUCER: And how did you become a stalking expert? What prompted that?
ST: As you know, it’s a very personal story for me. My daughter was, tragically, the victim of a male stalker, someone you would never suspect could commit such a crime. After Phoebe was taken from us, I became a little, well, obsessed with trying to understand why. When I looked into it, I was fascinated. Why do men act in this way and why, why do we allow it to happen? To woman after woman? I knew this was something that had to be understood better to stop it. So, I retrained in criminal psychology. Ever since, I’ve been working closely with the Met.
PRODUCER: I’m so sorry for your loss.
ST: Thank you. It doesn’t get easier for me, but I can try and help someone else.
PRODUCER: Turning our attention to the Zanna case. What elements do you think played a part in causing this tragic murder?
ST: Well, stalking is a crime based around a fantasy, and there are few lives that better exemplify that of fantasy than Hannah Zagalo’s.
Social media, like Instagram, gives us the ability to curate our lives. What we see on the feeds of social media users are fantasy lives, highlight reels. And when it comes to big, famous profiles like Zanna’s, this is exemplified tenfold. Being gifted designer bags, flying around the world for free and visiting beautiful places, who doesn’t want a part of that fantasy?
Celebrities have always had stalkers because their very essence invites the allure of fantasy; it’s how movies and magazines are sold. But celebrities have traditionally lived in gated communities, sharing only small slivers of their lives, drip-feeding fans in carefully chosen magazine interviews. Now, celebrities and social media stars are fused together, one and the same thing. This makes the job far easier for stalkers. When you share almost every aspect of your life it makes it easy for dangerous people to know where you are, and to feel like you are engaging personally with them.
PRODUCER: So, social media intensifies all that, and intensifies the experience the stalker is having?
ST: Exactly. Social media makes followers feel close to that individual, like they are living their lives with them — even if they have never met them. Every Instagram video from inside their home, every candid caption and holiday vlog showing minute details makes followers feel more and more connected, and more and more entitled, to details about the lives of these social media stars. The feeling of intimacy tricks the brain of a stalker and leaves some convinced they have relationships with these stars, friendships even.
PRODUCER: So stalkers think they are friends with the victim?
ST: Not always, no. Some stalkers believe they are friends with these people, or they will be, once they meet. A stalker feels such connection with someone before ever meeting them, they have the idea that they and the target are known to one another, although in fact they are not. We call these parasocial relationships. Most will have had one of these in some form. A sports fan, for example, is in a parasocial relationship with the members of their favourite team. Oftentimes these relationships help to soothe stress, and strained relationships in our own lives. But when these relationships intensify, they can become deadly.
Others are driven by disdain, or hatred, for someone, for an influencer. Perhaps what they represent. Perhaps they don’t approve of the person’s use of social media. This is something we see in cases of disgruntled exes or family members, fixating on the victims’ use of social media.
When it comes to more generalised stalking behaviour, though, with social media stars and fans, this is where we tend to see the lines get blurrier, and things get riskier. It’s all about sharing personal, private, real details. This — what some might call “oversharing” — encourages their star to rise and fosters intimacy between them and their viewer, until the scales tip. Now they find themselves world-famous or at least hugely popular with a devoted demographic, with the increased stalking fears that come with it. A great example of this are the YouTubers who shared the journey of purchasing their million-pound home, posting images of the inside of the house, the garden, and home tour videos on their channels. They invited fans to get involved on their moving day with a vlog.
Yet the stars were then faced with fans turning up to the house, peering over their garden fence. Parents lifted their children over the fence to take pictures inside the house. They were accused of “moaning about the price of fame”. The question seemed to revolve around whether individuals who found their fame by inviting strangers into intimate parts of their everyday lives deserved the same privacy as others.
PRODUCER: So stalkers can be motivated by hatred, or jealousy even?
ST: Absolutely. The most common form of stalking, the one we are most familiar with here, is a stalker who believes they are in love with their victim. But stalkers are not always motivated by romantic love either, that’s a common misconception. Sometimes, as I mentioned, they believe they have a friendship with the victim. Sometimes, they feel hatred towards that person. They may be envious. They may be acting out a feeling of being vindicated, or in the right. Perhaps they feel their victim is a fraud or a phoney. But does that mean stalking behaviour is justified?
PRODUCER: How do you spot a stalker?
ST: Well, that’s the frightening thing. We think stalkers are deranged people. Dangerous and rare people, people we would never know. Would certainly never be.
But how sure are you about that? How can you be sure someone you know, and know well, isn’t engaged in stalking behaviours now?
Researching someone online, “friending” someone, checking their profile, following someone you want to gain more information about, keeping tabs on someone via their social media, checking for constant updates on someone’s profile — these are all signs of stalking.
How often do you check the profile of an ex to see where they are? How often do you look up that old school friend to see how they are doing? How regularly do you use social media to look into the lives of people who may barely know you? How often do you “hate stalk” that frenemy? Have you set up a fake profile to follow an ex that blocked you? If so, there may be a secret stalker hiding inside you. Can you say for sure there isn’t?